So ridiculing a player that apparently is known to have mental health issues is comparable the tour to France??? Long bow champ!! Let’s go there then, if u grab a female work mate on the breasts, that’s cool as long as she can walk away, right???
Jackson Topine takes Bulldogs to NSW Supreme Court
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AmericanHistoryX
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Absolutely. But let's not interfere with Gould's history ......
BAGNF05
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Wow.
This absolutely broke my heart. My youngest son is the same age as these young men 😥😥😥
Titmuss’ family’s touching act as inquest into NRL training death nears conclusion
Titmuss’ family’s touching act as inquest into NRL training death nears conclusionwww.foxsports.com.au
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The mother of Manly Sea Eagles player Keith Titmuss told a court her son loved the club and his “brothers in arms”, before he died after his first pre-season session.
The young forward died in hospital after suffering seizures following a cardio workout at the club’s base at Narrabeen, on Sydney’s northern beaches, on November 23, 2020.
A coronial inquiry into the incident was told the 20-year-old suffered a heart attack in hospital, with his death determined to have been the result of exertional heat exhaustion.
Titmuss’ mother and father, Lafo and Paul Titmuss, as well as sister, Zara, and brother, Jesse, wore shirts with Titmuss’ face as they entered the NSW Coroners Court.
Addressing the court, Titmuss’ mother described her son as having been “cherished” from birth and as a “paragon of virtue”, who lived his life to “completeness”.
“Keith loved Manly. He loved his brothers in arms on and off the field. He loved the and respected the training staff,” Mrs Titmuss said, flanked by a photo of her son.
“After signing the contract he had an extra bounce in his step. He finally realised his commitment and hard work to become an NRL was about to happen. 2020 was going to be his year.”
Ms Titmuss expressed her gratitude for the “clarity and understanding of the events that lead to his death”, and said the inquiry could lead to changes for paramedics and the NRL.
“We are encouraged of the NRL’s internal review and its commitments to enhancing its knowledge and understanding across all clubs, staff and players,” Ms Titmuss said.
“Specifically, they seek to prioritise heat related injuries ... We hope the findings form this inquest will be instructive not just to the NRL, but sport across Australia and worldwide.”
Deputy State Coroner Magistrate Derek Lee, who became emotional after the statement, thanked Mr Titmuss’ family for reminding court about “Keith the son, brother, and partner”.
“From these learnings something might be done to prevent a similar tragic events happening again ... but we cannot forget the reason that has happened in the first palace,” he said.
“To be so generous to share collectively your memories ... I am very much grateful for that because it again reminds us more about Keith the footballer - the son, the brother, the partner.”
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Snidest 0
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His poor mum 😢 I can't imagine 😢
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I try my best to ignore you - but these are the members of the Titmuss family attending one of the five days of the exhaustive and traumatic coronial inquest into the professional negligence that caused the death of their 20 year old son - brother - cousin...
Show some respect!
AmericanHistoryX
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I dont know them. Im.sorry. so its my fault....what caused their dilemma? It wasn't you or me.
The 80s? I think you’ll find it’s a lot more current than that . It’s about getting an edge in such an ultra competitive market .
The storm and roosters having being pushing that line for the last 25 years . You can say it’s a workplace , and you’d be right of course , but if the best teams are doing this on the regular and this is how you get to the top and stay there . I mean ……
It’s like doing SAS selection and complaining there’s torture and sleep deprivation. That’s obviously the most extreme example ie. being you have to be more switched on than your enemy , but yea it’s a similar mindset .
Like I said the real issue isn’t that this goes on , but rather that this was such a shock to the player .
I was never an elite footballer , but I have a fair idea what mental and physical exhaustion combined with dudes yelling at you , feeling like a piece of shit , and having a massive hill both figuratively and literally to climb all at the same time looks and feels like .
I’m not defending anyone , but more just pointing out if the name of the game is winning , and the best teams do this to win …… how much winning are you getting done if your not willing to go to these places … it’s a conundrum.
BAGNF05
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It’s no ordinary workplace.
Lots of occupations carry additional risks to health and generally people go in with eyes wide open.
What does outdated denial of water, which is literally 80s mentality , have to do wrestling drills specifically designed to get you to a point of exhaustion and still excelling under that fatigue ?Maybe you should educate yourself and read the NSW Coronial Inquest report into the death of Keith Titmuss which was found to be caused by exertional heat stress that was inadequately identified and treated by Manly training staff due to an "inappropriate and UNSAFE training session"...
MMA fighters are self-employed bottom feeders who accept the risks to compete in a "sport" with no regulation against PEDs - concussion protocols etc - there is ZERO relevant comparison between professional rugby league players and MMA fighters!!
‘Inappropriate and unsafe’ training session before NRL player died
An intense training session on the first day of Manly’s pre-season in 2020 was beyond Keith Titmuss’ aerobic capacity, a coronial inquest into his death has heard.www.smh.com.au
View attachment 11661
A training session during which rising NRL player Keith Titmuss collapsed and later died was “unnecessarily and inappropriately tough” for a player of his aerobic capacity, an inquest has heard.
On the final day of submissions at the inquest into the death of the former Manly forward, the NSW Coroners Court was told the first official pre-season workout posed a risk to the player given its duration and intensity.
Counsel assisting Adam Casselden, SC, made several recommendations in the court on Friday, and submitted the session that Titmuss was put through on November 23, 2020, was “objectively tough, and perceived by the players to be tough”.
GPS data from the training session showed Manly players completed a 139-minute outdoor workout before jogging to a nearby gym, described as “hot and stuffy”, for further conditioning drills.
Former Manly coach Des Hasler, who was employed at the club at the time of Titmuss’ death, last month told the inquest the player’s training load of 47 metres a minute suggested it was a moderate session.
But Casselden relied on the evidence of several expert witnesses to suggest the training, which was held days after Titmuss was deemed to have the lowest aerobic capacity of any player in the squad after a yo-yo test, was beyond an acceptable level for him after an off-season break.
“It was unnecessarily and inappropriately tough given it was the first extended training session of the new season,” Casselden said. “It did not take into account an individual player’s characteristics.
“We submit, with the benefit of hindsight, [it was an] inappropriately high level of intensity and not of a safe level or environment.”
Manly’s legal counsel, Peggy Dwyer, SC, said there was “ample evidence there was a period of gradual training and acclimatisation, and players were encouraged to put their hand up if they’re struggling”.
The inquest heard the likely cause of Titmuss’ death was exertional heatstroke. Titmuss collapsed inside the club’s Narrabeen gym and later died of cardiac arrest. He was 20.
A paramedic who treated Titmuss at the Sydney Academy of Sport said the player’s temperature of 41.9 degrees was “the hottest I’ve ever seen”.
Titmuss was also found to have a 70 per cent narrowing of one of the heart’s main arteries during an autopsy, which one expert witness, Dr Simon Quilty, described as “very unusual” in a young man.
Casselden told deputy state coroner Derek Lee no findings should deem any Manly staff or attending paramedics liable for not detecting the “unusual” exertional heatstroke in the player.
Several of Titmuss’ teammates described seeing him suffer a seizure and involuntarily howling after initially complaining of cramps.
Casselden told the court Manly staff would not have been able to identify any potential dangers of exertional heatstroke from screening results taken days before the training session, and said their response to the medical emergency was “appropriate”.
But he questioned the conditions inside the club’s gym.
Titmuss’ former teammates Josh Schuster and Moses Suli, as well as attending paramedics, described the gym as “probably the hottest I’ve ever been in”, “oppressive” and “very humid”.
There were varying witness accounts of whether the cooling fans were on in the gym or the doors open at the time of Titmuss’ collapse, but Casselden said, “it [is] possible the coaching staff did not appreciate the need for the fans to be turned on”.
Dwyer admitted the gym would have been hotter than the outdoor conditions, which reached only 24.9 degrees at nearby Terrey Hills on the day.
But she said, “if [the fans] weren’t turned on, it was because the players didn’t think it was hot or stuffy enough for them to be turned on. They were clearly there and available.”
Manly have since had air-conditioning installed in the gym.
Casselden made several recommendations for Lee to consider amid the NRL’s ongoing review of its heat policy, including mandating a 14-day period of controlled training for players returning from an off-season break and individual training programs.
He also submitted players should be screened for known risk factors to exertional heatstroke, club medical officers to be present at sessions which might provide a greater risk to players, while also having a doctor sign off on strength and conditioning programs for players returning from extended breaks.
Casselden also suggested the NRL heat policy be updated to include clear rules on both indoor and outdoor training sessions alongside game-day protocols.
Titmuss’ family also recommended to the coroner the NRL be forced to mandate the reporting of all heat-related injuries from training and game days.
Since becoming aware of Titmuss’ likely cause of death, Casselden said, “both Manly and the NRL have taken positive, proactive and immediate steps”.
“Keith was clearly a well-loved and admired young man at that club,” he said.
They’re two separate issues ! The Titmus case was ridiculous and archaic , and I don’t really understand how that happened as denial of water ie. heat exhaustion and heat stroke has been talked about in say , elite defense training programs for years . Ao it would obviously be in most elite sporting programs .
But I don’t see the correlation ? Outside of a very thin connection that they’re related because they’re extreme training program techniques .
One is a HSE issue and a massive let down and failure on the training path for o not understand the data they’re supposed to monitoring , and the players affects in ridiculous heat .
it’s a very simple concept IMO . And really only 2 questions need be asked .
1. Is this type of training effective , and conducive to creating an elite football team ?
2. Did the player know that this was the type of level , intensity , mental strain , emotional strain , that was required of him ? And if not why not ?
Are you agreeing with me ?
BAGNF05
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100%. We don’t know the whole story.
What we do know is that rugby league / elite team sport culture will never be acceptable by snowflake standards.
??? You’ve lost the plot my guy .
The reason it relates to the Tour de France is they have to put themselves through literally torture to compete and get more oxygen in thier blood.
If you arnt willing to torture yourself to compete to win …. Then what the hell is the point? If that’s what it takes to win ?
I’m not saying it does . I’m more just pointing it doesn’t not either …. Only elite nrl programs , which as been highlighted in the Titmus case , arnt always where they should be , would know this .
Well they will … and those teams will come last . Which is ……. Ummm …… you know the cultural issues that we have been complaining about …………. My guys ?
BAGNF05
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I would say our guys have copped the same treatment from Madge from time to time. Not in any HR text book.
If the snowflakes were to win you’d never see another Craig Bellamy.
Exactly which is fine IMO. Best practice wins ! Unfortunately the hardest steel is forged in the hottest fires ….
AmericanHistoryX
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Beautiful words..
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The Fresh Oil
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Maybe you should educate yourself and read the NSW Coronial Inquest report into the death of Keith Titmuss which was found to be caused by exertional heat stress that was inadequately identified and treated by Manly training staff due to an "inappropriate and UNSAFE training session"...
MMA fighters are self-employed bottom feeders who accept the risks to compete in a "sport" with no regulation against PEDs - concussion protocols etc - there is ZERO relevant comparison between professional rugby league players and MMA fighters!!
‘Inappropriate and unsafe’ training session before NRL player died
An intense training session on the first day of Manly’s pre-season in 2020 was beyond Keith Titmuss’ aerobic capacity, a coronial inquest into his death has heard.
View attachment 11661
A training session during which rising NRL player Keith Titmuss collapsed and later died was “unnecessarily and inappropriately tough” for a player of his aerobic capacity, an inquest has heard.
On the final day of submissions at the inquest into the death of the former Manly forward, the NSW Coroners Court was told the first official pre-season workout posed a risk to the player given its duration and intensity.
Counsel assisting Adam Casselden, SC, made several recommendations in the court on Friday, and submitted the session that Titmuss was put through on November 23, 2020, was “objectively tough, and perceived by the players to be tough”.
GPS data from the training session showed Manly players completed a 139-minute outdoor workout before jogging to a nearby gym, described as “hot and stuffy”, for further conditioning drills.
Former Manly coach Des Hasler, who was employed at the club at the time of Titmuss’ death, last month told the inquest the player’s training load of 47 metres a minute suggested it was a moderate session.
But Casselden relied on the evidence of several expert witnesses to suggest the training, which was held days after Titmuss was deemed to have the lowest aerobic capacity of any player in the squad after a yo-yo test, was beyond an acceptable level for him after an off-season break.
“It was unnecessarily and inappropriately tough given it was the first extended training session of the new season,” Casselden said. “It did not take into account an individual player’s characteristics.
“We submit, with the benefit of hindsight, [it was an] inappropriately high level of intensity and not of a safe level or environment.”
Manly’s legal counsel, Peggy Dwyer, SC, said there was “ample evidence there was a period of gradual training and acclimatisation, and players were encouraged to put their hand up if they’re struggling”.
The inquest heard the likely cause of Titmuss’ death was exertional heatstroke. Titmuss collapsed inside the club’s Narrabeen gym and later died of cardiac arrest. He was 20.
A paramedic who treated Titmuss at the Sydney Academy of Sport said the player’s temperature of 41.9 degrees was “the hottest I’ve ever seen”.
Titmuss was also found to have a 70 per cent narrowing of one of the heart’s main arteries during an autopsy, which one expert witness, Dr Simon Quilty, described as “very unusual” in a young man.
Casselden told deputy state coroner Derek Lee no findings should deem any Manly staff or attending paramedics liable for not detecting the “unusual” exertional heatstroke in the player.
Several of Titmuss’ teammates described seeing him suffer a seizure and involuntarily howling after initially complaining of cramps.
Casselden told the court Manly staff would not have been able to identify any potential dangers of exertional heatstroke from screening results taken days before the training session, and said their response to the medical emergency was “appropriate”.
But he questioned the conditions inside the club’s gym.
Titmuss’ former teammates Josh Schuster and Moses Suli, as well as attending paramedics, described the gym as “probably the hottest I’ve ever been in”, “oppressive” and “very humid”.
There were varying witness accounts of whether the cooling fans were on in the gym or the doors open at the time of Titmuss’ collapse, but Casselden said, “it [is] possible the coaching staff did not appreciate the need for the fans to be turned on”.
Dwyer admitted the gym would have been hotter than the outdoor conditions, which reached only 24.9 degrees at nearby Terrey Hills on the day.
But she said, “if [the fans] weren’t turned on, it was because the players didn’t think it was hot or stuffy enough for them to be turned on. They were clearly there and available.”
Manly have since had air-conditioning installed in the gym.
Casselden made several recommendations for Lee to consider amid the NRL’s ongoing review of its heat policy, including mandating a 14-day period of controlled training for players returning from an off-season break and individual training programs.
He also submitted players should be screened for known risk factors to exertional heatstroke, club medical officers to be present at sessions which might provide a greater risk to players, while also having a doctor sign off on strength and conditioning programs for players returning from extended breaks.
Casselden also suggested the NRL heat policy be updated to include clear rules on both indoor and outdoor training sessions alongside game-day protocols.
Titmuss’ family also recommended to the coroner the NRL be forced to mandate the reporting of all heat-related injuries from training and game days.
Since becoming aware of Titmuss’ likely cause of death, Casselden said, “both Manly and the NRL have taken positive, proactive and immediate steps”.
“Keith was clearly a well-loved and admired young man at that club,” he said.
I agree but what’s with the strays for MMA lol.
The Fresh Oil
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Lucky he did or we’d be stuck with Matto!
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